Jury consultant Robert Hirschhorn told CNN on Monday that the prosecution’s lack of evidence in former President Donald Trump’s trial so far is a major issue that could lead to a “not guilty” verdict despite the likelihood of the jury being largely Democratic because of the Manhattan venue.


Transcript of the interview follows below:

Kaitlan Collins: We also have Robert Hirsch showing here with us. He’s an attorney and a jury consultant and has been walking through every step of this trial with us. And Robert, right now, the cross-examination is happening. Trump’s attorney is asking this witness, showing him emails from Michael Cohen in 2017 where Cohen’s signature block as they are, and it says, attorney doesn’t say fixer, which is often what Michael Cohen is known as. And he just said, it doesn’t say fix or does it? McConney confirms no. What do you make of this line of questioning from Trump’s attorneys?

Hirschhorn: Yeah, Kaitlan, thanks for having me back. Cases are won and lost on cross-examination, not direct examination. And the fact that what he’s trying to do is the whole idea, the moniker of the fixer. That’s not what this case is about. This is an accounting case. This is a crucial witness. He’s an accountant. If anybody did anything regarding how to record these records, how to put them in the books, it’s the accountants not Trump. And the fact that this witness said that he never had direction from Trump to falsify any records, that’s a huge problem for the prosecution’s case.

Collins: Well, and also I imagine this question may be something and the prosecution I should know will get a chance to re-question this witness, but McConney was just asked if he knows one way or another whether or not Michael Cohen actually did legal work for Donald Trump in 2017. He says, I do not know. Now we know there are other instances out there, people like Rudy Giuliani saying that Michael Cohen wasn’t doing any legal work, that he was getting paid, but they’re trying to make the point and draw some distance that McConney himself doesn’t know and that Cohen was not using a Trump org email account, a Trump organization email account. He was just using his own personal Gmail. What do you think of that up?

Hirschhorn: Well, look, I also think the prosecution’s also using the wrong guy. The guy that the prosecution ought to have up on the witness stand is Alan, who’s currently in the crossbars motel. And by the way, if President Trump keeps violating the gag order, he’s also going to get a little taste of the crossbars motel if he’s not careful. So look, here’s the point. This is the only person the prosecution could have to talk about the accounting side. At least so far, he’s the highest one up so far from the Trump org side. He has not provided Caitlin that crucial link between the crime and the defendant’s. Either knowledge about it or ordering that the documents be falsified. It’s a big problem. And I’m telling you, if they don’t fix this problem, what you’re looking at is this kind of verdict right here of a not guilty, even from a predominantly Democratic jury. They have to follow the evidence in the case. And if the state doesn’t link all this up, they’re coming in with a ‘not guilty.’

Former Trump Organization controller Jeffrey McConney testified on Monday, asserting that Trump never directed him to falsify documents under cross examination by the defense. McConney is yet another witness who has not proven direct involvement by the former president, with Hirschhorn saying even a Democratic jury is likely to acquit Trump if the prosecution does not eventually offer more compelling evidence.

Originally published by the Daily Caller News Foundation


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